Fibrephile vs. Knitter: Round One

Did you ever tell someone that you're both a knitter and a spinner and have them:

1. roll their eyes
2. raise their eyebrows and say, "you, like, knit on a bike at the gym? whoa."
3. exclaim - "There's not enough time to do both!"
4. respond, "I didn't know people still made their own yarn, I thought that went out with the dark ages" (and you didn't bother to tell them about the Industrial Revolution because, hey, its not your job to educate them)
5. listen to them tell you that "there's so much wool to be bought, why bother?"

I've actually had all of these reactions, from various people. For the record, the idea of me at a spinning class in a gym elicited the most obnoxious laughter I've ever had directed at me. From two different people. On two separate occasions.

One of the more memorable occasions (aside from the laughter, nay hysterics, over me setting foot in a gym) was in a yarn store. Someone was talking about going to Rhinebeck, and I chimed in (after going once and having my second visit in the planning stages) that she should definitely go. Her reply was something along the lines of, But I just like to knit and there's plenty of wool in shops to do it with. And isn't a fibre festival for spinners anyway?

Huh?

Before my dear-friend-Adelaide-who-I'm-meeting-for-lunch starts saying things about how I'm obsessive-compulsive and do everything to extremes, let me tell you that this is not .... well, this has nothing to do with that. I know other fibre people. Some of them the most mellow people you've ever met. Calm, relaxed, laid back and ...  sane.

There's something I've often felt out there. Some kind of divide between the fibrephiles and the knitters. There's overlap, but I'm not sure where it is. A fibrephile doesn't actually have to be a spinner. There are some spinners who don't knit much, and just love the spinning (these are rare). There are knitters who just love to knit. Fine and good, I can relate. There are even excellent, masterworks level knitters who have never once tried spinning. It's not a prerequisite at all. You can be a great knitter without spinning, but knowing your yarn is really important.

Then there are the Fiberphiles. Even those who don't spin. They KNOW. They know about types of wool and different fibres. They have enough experience to tell a lot just by feel. Rambouillet has its fans. Shetland has X, Y, and Z properties. Icelandic wool is good for certain things, maybe not perfect for others (hell, it can be itchy). Targhee is bouncy and spongy. Mohair has sheen and drape. Soy silk is... well, I think its genetically engineered and monstrous but that's just me.

Superwash wool squeaks. Can anyone tell me why it squeaks? Does anyone have a good explanation for what they do to the stuff that causes it to behave the way it does? I've tried looking it up, I've asked another blogger whom I respect to please write an informative, scholarly article about it. I can't even FIND the information. The only thing I came up with from reading ridiculous wool-industry technical surveys, is that people want their wool easy to care for, and superwash fits the bill. Sorry, that doesn't cut it for me. With the exception of knitting for the poor haggard mothers of newborns, I don't like easy care over natural fibres.

It's not so much a matter of doing it yourself, although most of the fibrephiles I've met have at least dabbled in spinning. It's something about the intimacy of spinning that draws one in, I think. Knowing the wool, in an almost biblical sense --- okay, I'm exaggerating but maybe what I mean is to understand it. To understand how it works and why it works the way it does.

How many things that you encounter during the course of your day do you truly know about and understand? Shoes on your feet? Most of us have never had a pair of handmade shoes. Computers - could you build one? Not likely. Chair your ass is glued to - could you make one? Very few people can anymore.

Lately I've found that trips to yarn stores don't always thrill me the way they used to. I know more than I did a few years ago about wool, and about knitting. Yes, I'm picky, but my knitting deserves it. I'm not suggesting that we all turn into snobs about this. But I think that if you know your wool (biblically speaking or otherwise) then you'll have a better relationship with it when it comes to knitting it. And the more you know about making it, the more informed you'll be when it comes to buying some at a yarn store for a project.

Am I right? I'll listen to anyone's arguments, pro or con.

Comments

[Sibylle]

I think the Quality of the wool is really important. When I was younger with less money I often bought cheap woll in not that good quality and it turned out, that the knitted stuff wasnt too good. My early projects have been like tents (my fault) and the yarn was looking bad after no time (not my fault).
No I think all the time i spend with knitting up stuff should be worth it, so that the knitted item got a long lifetime.
In the last weeks I was thinking about on superwashed wool which is very popular here ( lana grossa bingo) and I think it lost its natural touch, een it is 100% natural it does not look natural to me.
On the other hand I fall in love with some american yarn, I think lambs Pride is a fine one and I also like the Playmouth galway yarn.
Than I have knitted a cardi out of Debbie Bliss Cashmerino, very soft, very nice. But it is a cardi for my daughter and it is a the recommended yarn for it and it is pilling like hell. Leaves me some kind of angry that I spended 59 Euro for a children clothing and it workes out that after a few weeks ...

[Emma.]

Absolutely right !
I spin less than I did due to lack of time,but yarn you spin yourself is incredible to knit with.You know it intimately.Theoretically you can spin any type of yarn you want.Any colour/blend/effect,fiibre,texture,etc.That's exciting and liberating.
There are a couple of processes that make wool Superwash.They involve stripping the scales from the fibre.This prevents felting.It makes the wool very slippery - strange to spin prepared 'superwash' fibre.It also loses some of it's elasticity.Don't know why it squeaks though !

[Cara]

Oh man. Do I have to try spinning now too? I'm not picking no dung out of that stuff, that's for sure. I have been thinking about Rhinebeck, even though I can't see myself spinning any time soon - in the gym or otherwise.

[Susan]

I have to echo Sybille's comments. There are some lovely, natural fibers out there that pill like hell after only a few wearings. Is there a talent for inspecting a wool and determining that there are too many short fibers in it?
And, in defense of superwash wools; my experience has been that they soften up very nicely after a run through the washing machine and lose that weird, slippery feel.

[Adelaide]

Having been mentioned in your famous blog, I, too, will now be famous. You'll have to tell me how many times I've been hit. See you later.

[Lauren]

I call knitting muggles knuggles, so maybe these ignorant people to which you refer should be fuggles.

[juno]

No, I think you're right. Knowing your wool (I've never tried spinning. Yet.) is, I think, part of becoming a better knitter, as well as another way to really enjoy the textures and tactile pleasures of knitting.

For me, when I was a kid and first learned to knit, I really enjoyed it, but the only things out there - at least in my high school price range, but also I think the market was narrow then - were acrylics and blends. They squeaked, and they didn't drape right, so I learned to knit, made a sweater for a friend and then abandoned the whole thing.

When I started up again a year and a half ago, I was shopping for a gift for my sister in law and found myself fingering a scarf and thinking - hey this is really simple, I think I remember how to do this, and I was off with mohair and novelty yarn.

Which was great, but the earliest things I was attracted to yarn wise were in many ways the least successful because I was still learning how spin, weight and content affect the final products. I have documented my loathing for cashmerino aran extensively, but the fact that I chose it was part of the learning curve – I went for color and content without thinking about the spin and weight and how that would work in the application I wanted it for. The first sweater I made – a soy silk tank – also unsuccessful, but again, these aren’t mistakes I’ll repeat. (I still have to rip that sucker out. I think the yarn – which is strange, but not without appeal – will make a terrific summer shawl). The more I learn about such things, the happier I am with the process AND the end result.

For me the more I know about what and why I am choosing something, the more satisfying the whole process is. Mastery will probably always elude me, but the infinite potential to still be learning is one thing that makes knitting so attractive as a life-long activity.

[benedetta]

I don't know, for me it's more like this:
if you really like tasty ripe tomatoes, you grow your own (assumning that you are lucky enough to be able to do it), so if you really like knitting, you might want to learn to spin your own yarn
I'm just learning to spin, and my results are far from the perfection of commercial yarn, but it gives me tremendous satisfaction to be able to produce my own yarn.
I do not yet feel compelled to know a lot about different fibers etc., I certainly do not qualify as a fiberphile, i'm just enjoying extending spinning as an extension of knitting.

[Margene]

I am a fiber (fibre) snob, wool snob...I admit it. And being pretty experienced in knitting I can agree with everything you say. I love fiber festivals because I can buy the yarns I would like to spin. There just hasn't been enough time in my life to learn to spin but it is something I know I must (want and need) to do. It would be a theraputic and wonderful as knitting is and to make something from near 'scratch' would be a fine feeling.

[Julie]

I have been a knitter for nearly my whole life, had dabbled in weaving in the 60's (couldn't afford a floor loom so dropped that), and am now dipping my toes in the proverbial pond of spinning. I bought a handmade spindle and a book (Spin It by Lee Raven) and about 10 pounds of different rovings from different people and am now waiting for an afternoon to devote to experimenting with this. I have always bought yarn by the gut - meaning that if I got a thrill when touching it I would usually buy it. This has sometimes been disastrous. My mother bought yarn the same way, had an innate talent for mixing fibres and colors and ending up with the most stunning results. I know she had her mistakes too, but not very often. She used to knit herself dresses for crying out loud, on #2 circulars. When she would finish a dress for herself she would make a miniature one for my Barbie. I still have them. But I digress. I want to know how it feels to knit with my "own" yarn, so I will learn to spin. At first by hand, we'll see how that goes. Here's a thought: has anyone spun their dog's hair? I have a long haired German shepherd whose hair is fine and soft and is many different colors. I can imagine a lace scarf, light as air. Just thinkin out loud here.

[Julie]

PS I hate superwash wool. I have tried it several times because either the color appealed to me or a pattern called for it specifically, but the only projects I didn't throw out were hats and mittens for my nieces and nephews because I knew they would lose/outgrow them so it didn't matter. And I would like to know why it squeaks, too.

[Miriam]

As to Julie's question, yes, you can spin your dog's hair. It's just not a good idea to use it for an outer garment as it does smell like wet dog when you get it wet.

I'm starting a spinning class tonight. For me, the idea is to get the whole picture. Kind of like how an enlightened Buddhist can look at a flower and see the seed it came from, the flower it is, the sunshine and the earth and the water that helped it grow, and how the flower will eventually return to the earth and help to grow another flower. So, for me, I want to learn to spin for a sort of fiber enlightenment. I feel a deep need to have such an intimate knowledge of my finished piece.

M

[roggey]

I've been back to knitting after a 30 year hiatus (my grandmother taught me when I was 7 yrs old, then I promptly forgot all about it until last February) and I do love it. Yet, there's something in being able spin the very yarn you knit.

While I've been close to knowing my wool in the biblical sense (it was actually yak fibre), it's not like I'm walking around all "Full Monty" with it hanging off me in roving trails.

When I admit I spin as well as knit, I receive the same looks. Yet I get amazed looks & gasps of disbelief especially from other spinners when I say I do all my spinning on drop spindles and I don't like wheels.

Tried them, tried them, tried them. Nope. No sir. Don't like 'em at all. Sticking with the drop spindles. Yes. It's slow. Yes. It takes time and practice. Yes. I could get more yarn done and get to knitting more quickly.

Here's the kicker, I don't want to spin on a wheel because the sensual experience of spinning is too good to just let it fly by! I adore merino's softness and ability to soak up the dyes, the silky feeling of alpaca, the almost cloud weight of llama, the incredibly yummy buttery texture of yak fibre, and mohair? Damn, mama, could run my fingers through it all day long.

And yes, I've spun the hair from my afghan hound. It doesn't smell of dog any more than wool smells of sheep once it's been washed and blocked =)

[Dena Shunra]

Yes, I think you're right. It's sort of a matter of dimension: knitting is one step in, spinning is another, and it makes previous haunts look flat - I no longer think "yarn shop!" when I consider travel to new places. Yarn shop? there are three good ones, right nearby, no need to hurry into a new one and increase my stash. And there's so much more to spin.

It's also a matter of closeness to animals, for me. I spin yak, and know the yak more intimately than ever I've known one. I spin baby llama, and there is Natasha or whoever, and I'm as close to them as I am to my cats, as intimate with their fleece.

It feels like I've moved from one joy into another, deepening my pleasure although losing a certain amount of please I had before in simpler (go-out-and-shop-for-yarn) pursuits.

Or, in other words: gee, it keeps getting better!

[Dena Shunra]

Me too about the drop spindle, Roggey, and the sensory input from the fleeces. I could get drunk on baby llama. (Ok, I *have* gotten drunk on baby llama.)

[Angi]

Before I learned to spin, I asked my enabler friend, "Why would you want to spin your own yarn, when they sell it every day?" Her response was perfect. "The difference between handspun yarn and commercially spun yarn, is the same as the difference between Homebaked bread and store bought bread."

[dianne noe]

Yes, Yes , Yes! I've heard all these comments. Spinning and producing yarn for any length of time tends to make you a fiber "snob". Well there are more positive ways to put it.. For the most part I know not only the breed I am spinning, but the sheep it came from. I like to pick out the sheep then have it sheared. Nope, don't keep a flock, with with farms around it is quite possible to do this. I really enjoy taking a warm fleece and working with it! Like the whole process - even tho it is a lot of work.

[Sylvia]

The whole idea with superwash wool is to prevent felting by either eliminating with an acid treatment enough of the scales that they cannot lock or by coating them with resin to keep them from opening at all. The resin can feel a bit squeaky, and it can also impart a bit of a sheen to the wool.

Another way to limit or decrease felting and the resultant shrinkage and loss of elasticity is to combine untreated wool with non-felting fibers like the cellulosics (cotton, flax/linen, hemp, etc.) or synthetics (ack-ack, nylon, polyamid, etc.).

Both methods leave something to be desired, but the modern world is in a rush and has become enamored of mechanized washing, so the industry is doing its best to respond. Frankly, one of the most sensually satisfying experiences has got to be washing a handspun Merino lace scarf in extremely hot, soapy water. The wool becomes incredibly soft as the scales open and the staples relax in their bath.

And yeah, I spin. I have spindles, but my favorite is my custom Alden Amos electric. I started spinning because I couldn't find the yarn I wanted for my designs, and -- like Dianne (hi!) -- I like the whole process. I got the electric when a disease wonked my legs, and it's a perfectly balanced dream.

[roggey]

Dena~Yak is the schiznitz, isn't it? I'll give up real food and eat Top Ramen for a week to buy more of it every time...